- This topic has 9 replies, 4 voices, and was last updated 4 months, 2 weeks ago by Gillian.
March 14, 2021 at 3:17 pm #12729Teresa WParticipant
Hi Gillian, all,
I have found week 6 a bit confusing, so I’ve decided to go back to those parts of the course where I think I should work on.
The main one I could benefit from is meals and plans. However in my mind this is very similar to a diet if not the same. I don’t see why following a diet would be so negative when having meals and plans is also about setting limits through the implementation of certain restrictions. Is it just about the mindset? Or is it about self imposed restrictions vs. outside restrictions?
Many thanks in advance,
March 15, 2021 at 7:47 am #12736GillianModerator
I hope you got this sorted in our webinar yesterday, about the idea of ‘restrictions’ rather than ‘choices’.
My guess is that Times & Plans would be an excellent step for you – especially Plans. Now that you have a better grasp of free choice, what you can do next is to allow yourself to begin to experience your unsatisfied addictive desire, and use the technique of Plans in order to achieve this.
I strongly urge you not to aim for some perfect, ideal amount of food at first; simply a bit less than you would have consumed, enough to leave you with that feeling of desire for more. That is your starting point.
March 17, 2021 at 8:01 pm #12759Teresa WParticipant
Thank you very much for your answer, Gillian.
I find all this very difficult. Each time I try the Plans, I overeat much more than usual. I have gone back to lesson 2.7. I might be wrong, but I don’t feel deprived, just out of control and fearful about food. I guess than being obsessed with weight loss and trying to diet does not help, but these things are really ingrained in my mind. I think it’s the first I think when I wake up. And I don’t know how to stop thinking of them. In fact, I have to confess that I think that if I could diet it would be a great help for my health. I know this is at odds with this course, but I tend to identify diets with orderly eating.
March 17, 2021 at 10:16 pm #12761MoParticipant
I know what you mean Teresa. I feel I need to follow some plan, not a diet as such, but a plan. Just something to give me structure otherwise I feel I’m thrashing around in limbo. I’ll be revisiting times and plans soon to see if it helps me. Currently reviewing desire module again.
March 19, 2021 at 9:45 am #12778Teresa WParticipant
Thank you very much for sharing this, Mo. I love the idea of structure, just the idea makes my mind calm. I guess it’s nothing but an illusion, but I see it like the alternative to the chaos I have around eating. I wish you the best of luck when you revisit the idea of plans 🍀🍀🍀
March 18, 2021 at 8:00 am #12762GillianModerator
“Each time I try the Plans, I overeat much more than usual. I have gone back to lesson 2.7. I might be wrong, but I don’t feel deprived, just out of control and fearful about food.”
Are you saying you make a Plan to eat a particular amount and then continue to eat past your Plan and end up eating more than that amount? I would think that if you were going to feel deprived, you’d feel it if you didn’t eat past your Plan. You’re not likely to feel deprived if you are overeating, and even more than usual. What am I not understanding here? Are you making baby-step Plans?
“I don’t know how to stop thinking of them”
I have never suggested that anyone stop thinking about weight loss. What I suggest is that any time you think about your weight, you remind yourself of your non-weight motivation. Is that something you could aim to do, even sometimes?
“I have to confess that I think that if I could diet it would be a great help for my health. I know this is at odds with this course, but I tend to identify diets with orderly eating.”
I agree with you that diets are orderly, and if anyone wants to diet, I don’t mind at all. It seems to me that most people are doing this course because diets don’t work for them, so they are looking for an alternative. The techniques of Times (for snacking) and Plans (for overeating at meals) would bring some order (control) to your eating once you learn how to use them.
March 19, 2021 at 10:06 am #12779Teresa WParticipant
Gillian, many thanks for your response.
Yes, every day I try to eat according to a plan, but I eat much more than expected, some days I eat for hours. I would not say that I’ve made any baby step except for some days where I stick to the breakfast I planned and don’t eat anything until lunchtime. At lunchtime, I eat what I’ve planned, but 15 or 30 minutes later, I start eating again and don’t stop until all the food I have at home is gone. The truth is that most of the time, I don’t want to feel my addictive desire, I just want to eat and eat; at those moments, I am aware of the consequences, of how bad I am going to feel later, but the addictive desire is much more powerful.
I try to think about weight loss motivation, but again, non-weight loss motivation seems not to be so important to me. Some of the reasons I used to think of in the past to avoid overeating such as having more energy, have lost their importance because it’s like my body has adapted to the abuse, particularly now that I don’t move so much and spend the day working in front of my laptop.
March 19, 2021 at 12:50 pm #12782GillianKeymaster
“…every day I try to eat according to a plan…”
I wonder if you are in fact implementing the technique of “Plans” as I describe in the 4.2 video?
“…the addictive desire is much more powerful.”
This is because you have very little sense of free choice. My big concern is that you don’t even understand that this is the case and how important it is to your recovery.
“Some of the reasons… have lost their importance…”
I don’t buy this! You are very upset about your overeating, and not losing weight is just one part of that.
March 20, 2021 at 11:57 am #12792Teresa WParticipant
Gillian, thank you again for your answers.
Regarding your first question, the truth is that I don’t think I’m trying to implement the technique exactly as you describe it. You say that when following a plan, one should eat less, while still overeating. I don’t try to overeat at all. I try to follow a diet with little leeway in terms of quantities. I’m scared of allowing myself to overeat, even when I do it on a daily basis.
I think I do understand the idea of choice, the only issue is that to this idea of “I can eat whatever”, I always add “but I don’t want to”. Anyway, it’s like I have two minds, the one that doesn’t want to overeat (prefrontal cortex, I guess) and the addictive mindset that, in my case, seems to win all the battles.
Some years ago, very often I would do whatever it took in order to not overeat. Now, I actually tend to follow my addictive desire on every occasion. I wish I didn’t do, but I do very little effort to not act upon it. Indeed I care about the consequences, but it’s like I have become used to the idea of carrying some extra kilos because in any moment I might be serious, follow a diet and return to my normal weight (magic thinking, I know). I feel like I have become very childish in this area.
March 20, 2021 at 2:26 pm #12798GillianKeymaster
I’m not sure you are aware of how much you contradict yourself, but it’s not going to work for me to offer support when you a) change what you’re saying, b) say you are working with the techniques I teach but then say you are not, and c) seem not to understand the course material at all.
For example, you’ve said, “I can eat 8 kilos (more than 16 pounds) of food in a day and feel awfully in pain at the end of the day” and then say you have no non-weight motivation to eat less.
As another example, you say, “I’m scared of allowing myself to overeat…” and then, “I think I do understand the idea of choice…” These two statements – both in your last post above – are contradictory.
I do have a suggestion for you, and that is to step back from the course at this point in time. Don’t engage in any of the material, don’t visit the site or watch any of the videos. Just return to whatever you were doing before you ever heard of this course. THEN, begin the course at the start of May (or October if you prefer) as if for the first time. BUT understanding that there is a huge amount for you to learn here and the only way to do that will be to take it seriously, to study what’s being said and to take it on board.
The crucial factor will be that you start this course again with the intention of learning how to eat less – if that is what you want to do. My only other suggestion is for you to set up a one-to-one with me to talk this through – but I don’t think I’m getting through to you here in this forum.
The one thing I agree with you on is, “I feel like I have become very childish in this area.” I’d love to get through to the 49-year-old Teresa, but it’s not going to work if I’m playing games with your child self.
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